In the swirl of Super Tuesday, the Bush Administration launched its latest defense of waterboarding: after years of concealing, obscuring and denying it, the Administration declared it has nothing to hide.Apparently however, waterboarding is OK because "we do not torture" and "torture is illegal" so waterboarding must be legal and must not be torture. Don't you feel better now?
Late Update: The White House admits this was a conscious strategy.
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23 comments:
it just sickens me.
we are a better nation than this.
I take it that you are now going to call to the banning of water-boarding in US military training.
BTW, do you know how many terrorists were water-boarded? It is a epidemic.
Shredding the Torture Narrative
it just sickens me.
we are a better nation than this.
Wow, the same retort I get from progressives when I point out that Convention protections are reciprocal.
If one party does NOT accept and apply the conventions, the other parties are not bound by them.
I take it that you are now going to call to the banning of water-boarding in US military training.
I would like to clarify the above statement.
I meant the banning of water-boarding of US military personnel (such as would-be SEALs) in US military training.
Wow, I've been away for a while. How are those of you on the American left doing?
Hitgaagati elaykha! Ma Nishma?
Here you go again, deriding your own president while the real villains in this world continue to inlfict horrendous suffering all around the globe.
On Monday, a suicide bomber struck here in Israel, killing or wounding over a dozen people. Today, rockets continue to pound Sderot and the Western Negev, some of which have landed in schools and crashed into houses, injuring children.
In Iraq, bombs were strapped to two mentally challenged women to slaughter nearly one hundred innocent people, mainly kids. Where's your outrage over that?
In Somalia, bombs went off at a port, killing dozens of poor migrant workers as the al-shahaab insurgents continue to slaughter their own people. The first question is "why", but the other is why YOU don't seem to care. If those bombs had acciddentally been dropped from an American or Israeli aircraft, you people would be outraged.
Tell me, what good comes from portraying your own country as the bad guy while things like the above continue? You should be ashamed of yourselves.
That's a good point Moses...
If the left is so concerned about people being tortured, why don't they rant and rave about the current situation in Myanmar, where political opponents and prisoners are currently being executed by the truckload and protesters marching for democratic change are met with a hail of machine gun fire?
Once again, what is it to them? That isn't going to get them what they want politically, at least not near as much as screaming "Bush lied people died" and General Petraeus "Betrayed us".
...you got to admit, it is amusing though, especially when the left eats its own, ie the recent attacks on clinton and obama.
Hey. Right wing nutballs. Listen up.
First off. The Left DOES oppose human rights violations all around the world, every day...and I'd take a 10K bet that they do it FAR MORE than the Right does. Hell, it took the Bush administration about 4 years to FINALLY admit there was something approaching a genocide in Darfur.
Second, opposing what our own government does is not mutually exclusive. We have the ability to dislike outrageous behavior from Our President as well as the vicious dictators and wackos around the globe.
Third. We are a nation of laws. You seem to think that, for the sake of expediency, "anything goes." That waterboarding is OK as long as it meets some litmus test which only the government can explain, and then, only after the fact.
Well, if anything goes with waterboarding, where exactly do you draw the line? Is it OK for the government to enter your house without a warrant probe your computer to see what stuff you've been downloading? Is it OK to hold you in prison for a few months for a traffic violation because they knew that you voted a particular way and now they're going to make you pay for it?
Torture is the ultimate slippery slope. If we, as a nation, can't call it unjust and dismiss it out of hand, then we essentially abandon any claim to a moral high ground.
Pilt
Third.
"Hell, it took the Bush administration about 4 years to FINALLY admit there was something approaching a genocide in Darfur."
Yep, and today, we're one of the only country's calling it for what it is...GENOCIDE.
"The Left DOES oppose human rights violations all around the world, every day...and I'd take a 10K bet that they do it FAR MORE than the Right does."
Where were you during the genocide in Rwanda? Bill Clinton sat back and did nothing during the genocide, while 8,000 people were being killed and hundreds of thousands of bodies were flowing down the rivers of central africa. He did absolutely nothing to jam the Hutu radio stations that were promoting the killing spree, which in the end proved to be the most efficient in human history.
Thank you anon, for your ananlysis, but I am not a "right wing nutball". I want unity, meaning I want everyone to work together to take on the real bad guys...the terrorists, the genocidal militias, and the dictatorships in this world.
Bush is not perfect, far from it in fact. However, he took the right action in regards to the genocide that was happening in Iraq. If it weren't for the divisive rhetoric being spewed out on your side that has hacked away at his presidency, I have a feeling he'd do something to help the people of Darfur, just as he did for the people of Iraq and Afghanistan.
...you left wing kooks just get crazier.
"Bill Clinton sat back and did nothing during the genocide, while 8,000 people were being killed"
Let me clarify...I meant to add "every day for over three months"
Truly horrorfying...
Where were you during the genocide in Rwanda?
The correct question you should be asking yourself, C.H., is "Where was C.H. while all those people were being killed in Rwanda?" Where was C.H. when women were being killed in Saudi Arabia for the crime of being raped? Where was C.H. when the Israelis killed women and children in Lebanon? And, by the way, where was C.H. when his heros in the U.S. Government were subjecting people to torture that they executed their enemies for perpetrating.
Convention protections are reciprocal.
Meaning, of course, that now Americans are subject to torture by anyone who captures them.
Sherry, of course it sickens you. It sickens any decent person.
"Bill Clinton sat back and did nothing during the genocide, while 8,000 people were being killed"
But C.H. lead a rescue mission to Rwanda, I suppose?
You Wingnuts are so terribly angry and negative. Why don't you ever tell us about the good things that Lefties are doing?
"Where was C.H. while all those people were being killed in Rwanda?"
C.H. was in school back then and could only watch in horror on his tv screen while his government did nothing. Since that day, C.H. has since become a member of UNHCR and continues to use every right granted to him to raise awareness about tragedies happening around the world.
C.H. was in school back then
And? Did you drop out and go to Rwanda? Or did you stay in school while this atrocity was going on and live off the wealth of your parents?
and continues to use every right granted to him to raise awareness about tragedies happening around the world.
..except those tragedies that were caused and continue to be caused by his very own government, and which tragedies he continues to support.
Let's continue the biography of this humanitarian hero who calls himself by various names on liberal blogs.
C.H. had a choice. He could assuage his conscience by "working" through an admittedly powerless organization and sitting on his ass in San Francisco, all the while complaining about a President who did more to alleviate suffering in the world than the all the Republican presidents since Lincoln. Or he could join the military and actually do something about suffering people in Afghanistan or Iraq. He chose the "sit on his ass and pretend to help" option. Perhaps C.H. was hindered by Republican majorities in both houses of Congress as was President Clinton.
Let's examine another beneficent choice C.H. has made. He has chosen to support for the office of President of the United States a man who has promised to keep American soldiers dying in Iraq for the next 100 years, where said soldiers will continue to kill and displace Iraqis.
Further, C.H.'s choice for President has also promised "there will be other wars. We will never surrender." The same candidate sat back and did nothing while soldiers returning from his favorite blood bath received shoddy medical treatment. In fact, C.H.'s candidate embraced the president who started the war and who oversaw the collapse of medical care for soldiers.
C.H. made another choice we should acknowlege tonight. He decided that the vast majority of scientists in the world -- as well as most thermometers -- are lying. For this reason, C.H. has joined the ranks of another group who advocates doing nothing to prevent massive human misery in the near future -- the Global Warming Deniers. His opinion is that the droughts, famines, and extinctions that will occur in the next 40-50 years will make the human race stronger and more able to live on the surface of Venus -- another planet where the greenhouse effect has had beneficial results.
And for these reasons and so many others, ladies and gentlemen, we honor C.H. tonight as Compassionate Hyper-Conservative of the Year. Give it up for the next winner of the Nobel Peace Prize winner and the apparent reincarnation of Mother Theresa.
That was an intersting and comical biography shitrock.
I say you and I put together a book deal and find ourselves publisher, what do you say?
However, I'd like to ad my travels to Northern Ireland, Morocco, and Costa Rica in there as well as my upcoming assignment in Tanzania this Summer...in addition to the part about me "sitting on my ass in san francisco".
I'm not sure, but I think shitrock just got pwned...
sorry mate, you really made yourself look like an ass in your personal hitpiece on C.H.
I've read some of his posts and he definetely takes issue with some enviromental problems...look at the title of his blog. Just because he's not buying into the al gore hysteria doesn't make him a bad person.
Try looking somehwere other than the left, mate. Everyone's got something to offer.
Everyone's got something to offer.
Yes, tis true.
And, the Bushies offer torture in place of the rule of law.
C.H., does the UNHCR has jobs for all of us?
Did Clinton authorize torture of detainees and spying on US citizens?
The world can be described as black and white, but then I have to ask, do you never make mistakes? Does the UN never make mistakes? Sometimes I find I have to weigh good versus bad in things, not just make absolute statements.
John K. says: Yes I do feel safer. And based on the fact that we have not been attacked since 9-11 it must be working. If it sickens you, then you need to be near a garbage can so you can throw up in an environmentally manner.
C.H., I've got you beat by a couple of dozen countries, but I don't claim to be saving the world. Who paid for your junkets, I wonder. Probably I did, but that's OK as long as you saved a lot of starving infants in Northern Ireland and Costa Rica? How did you do rescuing refugees in Marin County? How about the "Feed the Hungry of Sausalito" campaign?
I'll tell you what. If you can find a publisher interested in your most faskinatin' life, I'll be happy to do the writing and augment your disability in that area.
Your tactics are improving, though. I note your prudence in not degrading yourself by even attempting to defend Sen. McCain's mediaeval, perpetual-war policies. And the fact that there were dozens of tornadoes overnight IN EARLY FEBRUARY certainly makes Al Gore look foolish, does it not?
Oh, you should be sure, Mr. Acks. Thanks for letting me know about my humiliation. If you hadn't told me, I would have thought I had scored some fairly accurate points about a one of your fellow whackos. Now that I recognize my ignominy I'll have the opportunity to deal with my shame.
I find it quite amusing how our local trolls call us liars, hypocrites, loons, and traitors with all the ease of a Yale Tri-Delt going down on Dubya, but just return the favor and watch them squeal.
You guys who represent the right wing of the right wing of the right wing of the Republican right wing really need to:
-- Try the decaf and lay off the Jolt for a couple of days.
-- Have your children buy you a sense of humor just as they are buying welfare for Halliburton and Lockheed-Martin.
-- Stop being so negative all the time. You can't see straight with all your hatred for Al Gore.
Convention protections are reciprocal.
Meaning, of course, that now Americans are subject to torture by anyone who captures them.
You mean instead of getting their heads chopped off and their bodies mutated and booby-trapped?
So you are saying that US Military prisoners have always been treated according to Geneva Conventions until the Bush administration opened Gitmo?
If you are at war with the US and you/your country treats US Military prisoners according to Geneva Conventions, then you are entitled to Geneva Conventions protections.
Were any of the three guys water-boarded fighting the US according to the Geneva Conventions?
Of course the anti-war progressives give Iran a free pass on the Geneva Conventions.
Iran To Violate The Geneva Convention
No one answered my question.
Do you support the banning of water-boarding of US military personnel (such as would-be SEALs) in US military training.
No one answered my question.
Do you support the banning of water-boarding of US military personnel (such as would-be SEALs) in US military training.
We don't answer your questions because (a) You're a troll who only posts here to find excuses to call people who make sense liars; and (b) because it's hard to believe that even you take your questions seriously.
Not that this was a serious question either, but I'll be happy to make you look like a fool again:
It is my understanding, although you are free to correct me, that the members of our armed forces are volunteers. As such, they have volunteered to undergo this training. Since I voluntarily undergo the torture of reading your hateful inanity, I understand the concept of masochism and support the right of all volunteers to have their lungs filled with water.
For the same reason, I support the use of waterboarding for all political prisoners of the Bush Disadministration who volunteer for it.
Now, was there another stupid question, or would you prefer that I just go fuck myself?
I understand the concept of masochism and support the right of all volunteers to have their lungs filled with water.
I hope the same applies to eating habits and smoking.
That was very unprogressive of you.
I thought that one of progressive's main tenants is that the State must protect people from themselves and any bad choices that they did.
I hope the same applies to eating habits and smoking.
Eating habits? Yes. Smoking? Yes, as long as you don't force it on me. I encourage you to kill yourself any way you care to.
I thought that one of progressive's main tenants is that the State must protect people from themselves and any bad choices that they did.
-- We already knew that that's what you thought. You are in this case, and as usual, mistaken.
-- Only lefties who are landlords have tenants. The rest of us have tenets, which are like principles, which is probably why you were unfamiliar with the word.
-- You forgot to call anyone a liar so far today. You're letting the team down.
Neither C.H. nor shitrock
Neither heir nor ed
Neither john k. nor sherry
Neither dayvoe nor maria
Neither Al Gore nor the scientists
Neither the UN nor the US
Neither left nor right
Neither Mccain nor Clinton
Neither Romney nor Obama
Neither Edwards nor Huckabee
Can solve the problems facing suffering people all over the world by themselves.
Long live unity and a free and democratic world!!!!
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