Fred Honsberger Gets It Wrong...

And asks the wrong questions.

Fred's facebook announcement regarding today's radio show:

Is putting a bug in a room with a terrorist torture? The president thinks so. He's released the CIA "torture memos"...has this hurt the country?

From the get-go, Fred's got it wrong. Here's what he's talking about. In one of those torture memos (and we're happy Fred recognizes that we're talking torture here - at least I hope he recognizes that it was torture), specifically this memo written August 1, 2002. The memo was written as a response to a request by John Rizzo, then Acting General Counsel of the CIA. Rizzo evidently inquired whether a number of interrogation techniques would violate Section 2340A of title 18 of the US Code. Ninth on the list we find:

(9) insects placed in a confinement box

In a confinement box, Fred. Not "in a room." Here's what the memo says about "cramped confinement:

Cramped confinement involves the placement of the individual in a confined space, the dimensions of which restrict the individual's movement. The confined space is usually dark.

The duration of confinement varies based upon the size of the container. For the larger confined space, the individual can stand up or sit down; the smaller space is large enough for the subject to sit down. Confinement in the larger space can last up to eighteen hours; for the smaller space, confinement last for no more than two hours.

So Fred's imagery is misleading at best and if he knew what the memo actually said,he's just being plain dishonest.

But while we're at it, let's take a closer look at title 18 - specifically the definition of torture found there. It starts:

(1) “torture” means an act committed by a person acting under the color of law specifically intended to inflict severe physical or mental pain or suffering (other than pain or suffering incidental to lawful sanctions) upon another person within his custody or physical control

It then goes on to further define "severe mental pain or suffering" as prolonged mental harm caused by (in this instance):

(A) the intentional infliction or threatened infliction of severe physical pain or suffering;

Now let's go take a look at the memo. We see what the CIA wanted to do (page 3):

You would like to place Zubaydah in a cramped confinement box with an insect. You have informed us that he appears to have a fear of insects. In particular, you would like to tell Zubaydah that you intend to place a stinging insect into the box with him. You would, however, place a harmless insect in the box.

And Bybee's advice (page 14):

In addition to using the confinement boxes alone, you also would like to introduce an insect into on of the boxes with Zubaydah. As we understand it, you plan to inform Zubaydah that you are going to place a stinging insect into the box, but you will actually place a harmless insect in the box, such as a caterpillar. If you do so, to ensure that you are outside the predicate act requirement, you must inform him that the insects will not have a sting that would produce death or severe pain. If, however, you were to place the insect in the box without informing him that you are doing so, then, in order to commit a predicate act, you should not affirmatively lead him to believe any insect is present which has a sting that could produce severe pain or suffering or even cause his death [redacted material] so long as you take either of the approaches we have described, the insects’ placement in the box would not constitute a threat of severe physical pain or suffering to a reasonable person in this position. An individual placed in a box, even an individual with a fear of insects, would not reasonably feel threatened with severe physical pain or suffering if a caterpillar was placed in the box.

So putting a man (one with an irrational fear of insects) in a confinement box with a harmless insect, as long as you don't lead him to believe:

1) that an insect is present (presumably hoping he'll discover it himself) or
2) that the insect will cause "severe physical pain" or death

isn't torture, so sayeth the Bush Administration.

However if the fear is irrational, you wouldn't need to inform him of the "danger" of the insect. He'll already believe it. The end result is the same. And they knew that. What's the whole point.

All of this, of course, is besides the point - as weighed against Fred's rhetorical question:

has this hurt the country?

The damage there has already been done. Torture has already been shown to have occurred.

The Red Cross said so:

The allegations of ill-treatment of the detainees indicate that, in many cases, the ill-treatment to which they were subjected while held in the CIA program, either singly or in combination, constituted torture. In addition, many other elements of the ill-treatment, either singly or in combination, constituted cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment.

By attempting to divert attention to "a bug in a room" Fred is doing a disservice to his audience and the truth.