Prosecute the torture.

January 9, 2011

STFU with the eliminationist rhetoric

"Don't Retreat, Instead - RELOAD!"
- VP Candidate & Gov. Sarah Palin, Republican

"I hope that's not where we're going, but, you know, if this Congress keeps going the way it is, people are really looking toward those Second Amendment remedies and saying my goodness what can we do to turn this country around? I'll tell you the first thing we need to do is take Harry Reid out."
- Senate Candidate Sharron Angle, Republican

“We have become, or are becoming, enslaved by the government ... I dare ‘em to try to come throw me in jail. I dare ‘em to. [I’ll] pull out my wife’s shotgun and see how that little ACS twerp likes being scared at the door. They’re not going on my property.”
- CNN Commentator Erick Erickson, Republican

"I want people in Minnesota armed and dangerous on this issue of the energy tax, because we need to fight back."
- US Rep. Michele Bachmann, Republican

"Our nation was founded on violence. I don't think that we should ever remove anything from the table as it relates to our liberties and our freedoms."
- Texas Candidate for U.S. Rep. Stephen Broden, Republican

"We are aware that stepping off into secession may in fact be a bloody war. We are aware. We understand that the tree of freedom is occasionally watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots.”
- Texas Gubernatorial Candidate Debra Medina, Republican

"Does sharia law say we can behead Dana Milbank?...I think you and I should go and beat him up."
- Fox News Host Bill O'Reilly, Republican

"Put anything in my scope and I will shoot it."
- U.S. Rep. Joe Barton, Republican

"Meet Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson."
- Conservative Radio Show Host Glenn Beck, Republican

(More here)

While most Republicans seem to take their cue from their patron saint Ronald Reagan that government is the problem, a current segment of that party takes it one step further by not just constantly disparaging government, but calling for its violent overthrow -- or at the very least using eliminationist rhetoric against Democrats.

And, I'm calling BULLSHIT right now on anyone who tries to paint some false equivalency. There simply isn't this level of violent language by politicians, political candidates and cable hosts coming from the Democratic side.

I'm also calling BULLSHIT on anyone who would try to say that when Jared Lee Loughner killed six people and wounded 13 others yesterday including Democratic Rep. Gabrielle Giffords at her own event that this was just some "crazy person" acting out and that it was not a political act. Loughner could have just as easily gone to a mall or a McDonald's or a school. But he didn't. He targeted a politician -- and a Democratic politician. He clearly had problems with the government as seen by his now deleted MySpace page:


He was anti-government, anti-federalist, pro gold standard, and he compared a young woman to a “terrorist for killing the baby” so he sure as hell wasn't a liberal.

What he seems to be is a mentally disturbed individual living in a time of historic vitriolic rhetoric and in a place where threats and violence had already been directed towards Giffords as noted by Pima County Sheriff Clarence Dupnik:


What had been aimed already at Giffords? Sarah Palin had her in her crosshairs:


We have this from her Tea Party opponent:


And, we have the Congresswoman's own words on the issue:


We also have six dead and 13 wounded, including:

A Congresswoman fighting for her life:

Gabrielle Giffords

A slain chief judge for the United States District Court:

John M. Roll

And, a little girl cut down in her ninth year of life:

Christina Taylor Greene

Christina was born on 9/11. She was a member of her student council who was brought to the event to meet a role model.

Shortly after the massacre, Sarah Palin deleted the "crosshairs" from the web. Would that she and her ilk delete any more violent garbage from coming out of their mouths.
.

36 comments:

C.H. said...

This story is turning out more like the Holocaust Museum shooting, where militant leftist hypocrites saw an opportunity to lay the carnage at the feet of Republicans, only to have it turn around and bite them in the a$$. James Von Brunn, the shooter, turned out to be an anti-Bush, 9/11 conspiracy theorist who authored a screed against the Iraq War and, I should add, also hated McCain, Palin, and Dick Cheney. Which side does that fall more in line with?

There is not one shred of evidence that Jared Loughner supported Sarah Palin or even followed her statements...the same goes with Glenn Beck. It won't surprise me if Loughner hated Palin, Bush, and the neocons, just like Von Brunn. He was a pot smoking, atheist fanatic and a college student, after all...hardly the type of person who follows the above mentioned.

I call BS on sadistic political extremists who use tragedies to advance their political agendas. BTW Dayvoe, didn't you call for America to not rush to judgement after the Fort Hood shooting? If so, that was good advice at the time...apply it to Loughner too, please.

Dr. Monkey Hussein Monkerstein said...

Well said. I agree with everything you wrote.

rich10e said...

here are some influences in this idiot's life..."Alice's Adventures in Wonderland" and "Through the Looking-Glass" by Lewis Carroll; "The Wonderful Wizard of Oz" by L. Frank Baum; "Peter Pan" by J.M. Barrie; and "Gulliver's Travels" by Jonathan Swift. Still others were a range of political tracts: "The Communist Manifesto" by Karl Marx, "Mein Kampf" by Adolph Hitler, "The Republic" and "Meno" by Plato.

One was a novel about a sane man who is sent to an insane asylum: "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest" by Ken Kesey.

Read more: http://post-gazette.com/pg/11009/1116756-84.stm#ixzz1AZAh5Kuz

Joshua said...

Oh, but there is evidence he belonged to or was affiliated with a white-supremacist group. Those types tend to ally very strongly with Ron Paul and other Tea-Bagger types. And don't give me that about Von Brunn, because some of his words could have easily come out of Ron Paul's mouth. And BTW, I wouldn't be surprised if there were some antisemitic tendencies to Loughner as well.

C.H. said...

"BTW, I wouldn't be surprised if there were some antisemitic tendencies to Loughner as well."


Neither would I.


"And don't give me that about Von Brunn, because some of his words could have easily come out of Ron Paul's mouth."


Ron Paul and other far-right isolationists, like Pat Buchanan, were allied with the left during the Bush years. Reading their statements about Bush, Iraq, 9/11, Israel, Cheney, etc. is indistinguishable from the vitriol you find on Daily Kos and Countdown.

rich10e said...

Joshua...too bad we don't hear anything about antisemitism from progressives when Islamo-facists are about their work...

Ol' Froth said...

Look over here!

Piltdown Man said...

This was bound to happen. And bound to happen again.

Whatever the man's motivations, we all must agree (can't we?) that the level of violent "hate speech" evinced by the plethora of quotes which Dave posted is just flat out wrong, evil and unwarranted. You simply can't go on and on spouting this sort of rot and expecting that nothing will happen....

Conservative Mountaineer said...

Oh, puleezz. You lefties are so predictable. If I had the time, I could post at least as many inflammatory-type proclamations issued by Liberals and Liberal supportors... issued in the very recent time period.. issued by none other than Obama, Ried, Pelosi, Mcaskill, the Daily KOS loonie, Olbermann.. need I go on? Didn't think so.

This Loughner is a nutcase, pure and simple.

But, that wouldn't fit your template or register in your little mind, would it?

Conservative Mountaineer said...

@Piltdown Man..

What about the hate speech so freely espoused on Daily KOS and Democrat Underground? By Olberman? By Maddow? By Obama? By Reid? etal Hmmm??

Oh, I forgot. Only the Right is hateful. My bad. KMA.

Joshua said...

CM, trust me, I know all about incitement from the left. Heck, there's a whole website dedicated to pointing it out at HP Monitor. But we aren't talking about that right now.

gtl said...

mountaineer,

Please, take the time. Post any and all " inflammatory-type proclamations issued by Liberals and Liberal supportors... issued in the very recent time period.. issued by none other than Obama, Ried, Pelosi, Mcaskill, the Daily KOS loonie, Olbermann.."

You asked "Need I go on?"

Yes, you do.

Piltdown Man said...

Methinks my right wing friends doth protest too much....

Please show me the attribution to the last time that President Obama incited violence...

Sure, from time to time a liberal steps over the line, but the Right is DEFINED by this sort of over-the-top invective. It is the defining characteristic of your most beloved commentators. Worse yet, in recent years, their craziness became part of general campaigns, from Tom Coburn to Michelle Bachmann, and so many others....

EdHeath said...

I would say this event is a lot closer to the Poplaski incident. It is a continued reminder that the easy availability of high powered high capacity firearms, concealable or not, has tragic consequences for us all.

I will say that those Republicans who oppose any form of gun control might look in their hearts. I guess though, that conservatives like CM have too much anger at Democrats to take any action or allow any action to be taken to prevent their deaths. Lord knows since Democrats sometimes suggest that the rich could help the rest of the country, death is too good those Democrats.

Heir to the Throne said...

gtl
Olbermann: Called Michelle Malkin “big mashed up bag of meat with lipstick”

BTW Dav I saw the video of the Bill O'Reilly quote.
He put disclaimers all around it that he was kidding.

So much for progressive do not edit quotes out of context.

gtl said...

httt: That's it? That's "inflamatory proclamation?"

Are you seriously saying that rises to the level of inciteful rhetoric reached by any of the examples given in the original post? The Con 'eer made it sound like he'd have no trouble at all posting examples of vitriol from Obama, Reid, Pelosi, Olberman, et al. And all you can come up with is a an insult of Michelle Malkin's looks?

Well, at least you tried, I guess.

Heir to the Throne said...

gtl
I took it as he want to turn her into “big mashed up bag of meat with lipstick” by beating her senseless. And since Olbermann does not give his opponents the benefit of a doubt, I feel he deserves the same treatment.

Do you really want to open his can of worms? Do you want me to go nutpicking and claim that they represent the entire progressive movement.


“My CongressWOMAN voted against Nancy Pelosi! And is now DEAD to me!”


Kos
"Screw them"

Ted Rall on MSNBC
MSNBC Talks Violent Revolution

EdHeath said...

HTTT, you go ahead and say that Loughner (sp?) is a liberal. You go ahead and say this is some sort of leftest plot. Say it over and over again until you feel it's true. That won't change the fact that six more people are dead from our national epidemic of gun violence. That the mentally unstable like Poplawski and Loughner are able to waltz into gun shops and pick up massively lethal weapons.

But we are safer because we can own assault rifles.

Heir to the Throne said...

HTTT, you go ahead and say that Loughner (sp?) is a liberal. You go ahead and say this is some sort of leftest plot.
Sauce for Goose
Progressive tried to paint Jared Loughner: 9-11 Truther and atheist as one of Palin's base.

BTW one of the guys who held him down waiting for the police was trying to break his arm.
I am sure progressives and Glenn Greenwald will excuse his crime due to this brutality like Bradley Manning.

More for gtl from the “big mashed up bag of meat with lipstick”
The progressive “climate of hate:” An illustrated primer, 2000-2010

rich10e said...

I agree with Ed's comment, " That won't change the fact that six more people are dead from our national epidemic of gun violence. That the mentally unstable like Poplawski and Loughner are able to waltz into gun shops and pick up massively lethal weapons." It does create a dilemma. In the last four or five weeks in the Pgh area three would be assailants have died in the act of committing a crime at the hands of their victims.Two were shot be the intended victims a third was killed with his gun during a struggle with his victim. I don't own a gun nor do i see the logic in having anyone owning an assault rifle. A weapon for mass killing.What is the happy medium where home owners, business owners and people on the streets can adequately defend themselves from deadly assault and the demands of a safe, peaceful society? Just the same blaming the actions of this psychopath on any political group is disingenuous.

gtl said...

httt,

1) Breaking the arm of an assailant with a gun is standard procedure. I'm not sure what "crime" you see in that act, or what crime anyone else would see in it, either. Except you, apparently.

2) Con 'eer specifically said that "[He]could post at least as many inflammatory-type proclamations issued by Liberals and Liberal supportors... issued in the very recent time period.. issued by none other than Obama, Ried, Pelosi, Mcaskill, the Daily KOS loonie, Olbermann.. "

All I have from you, and, for that matter, from Michelle Malkin, are...well, let's see. There's the one insult to Malkin's looks, and, beyond that, blog replies from nobodys. With some Sandra Bernhart tossed in. Who among them would you say is the closest to "Obama, [sic]Ried, Pelosi, [sic]Mcaskill, or even Kos, or Olbermann in prominence?

Who would you say was the most prominent among those that you have placed in evidence?

Heir to the Throne said...

Gtl
Breaking the arm of an assailant with a gun is standard procedure. I'm not sure what "crime" you see in that act, or what crime anyone else would see in it, either. Except you, apparently.
standard procedure?
Loughner was not being held down by Law enforcement.
He was held down by civilians until Police arrived.
I see no crime in getting a bit rough with someone who just shot innocent people. However you should refer to Glenn Greenwald's objections to Bradley Manning's treatment because he has not been convicted in court yet.

rich10e said...

gtl...how are these...Barack Obama has said the following:

If they bring a knife to the fight, we bring a gun. – June 2008.

I want you to go out and talk to your neighbors… I want you to argue with them, get in their faces. – September 2008.

I don’t want to quell anger. I think people are right to be angry. I’m angry. – March 2009.

If Latinos sit out the election instead of saying, “We’re gonna punish our enemies and we’re gonna reward our friends who stand with us on issues that are important to us,” if they don’t see that kind of upsurge in voting in this election, then I think it’s gonna be harder, and that’s why I think it’s so important that people focus on November 2. – October 2010.

Heir to the Throne said...

gtl
MSNBC's Ed Schultz: “Rip it [Cheney's heart] out and kick it around and stuff it back in him”

Ol' Froth said...

Thgat's the best you can do Rich? Not ONE of those is an incitement to violence, or a call, either direct or implied, for people to be shot. Until you can come of with examples of democratic officials or left-leaning commentators regularly calling for the use of deadly force on their opponents, all your examples amount to nothing more than false equivilence. You simply don't find examples of things like this on the left.

rich10e said...

Frothy..there's no one out there saying, hey if you have a long burning grudge with a congress member
who didn't answer your asinine question the way you wanted, go out and shoot them and their followers....this guy was a total head case...now if you wanna blame palin,beck,van jones, cloward and piven, go ahead...

gtl said...

httt: The standard for use of force in such a situation is no different for citizens or police. If the citizen felt that it was necessary to break and arm, or even to kill Mr. Loughner, to keep him from continuing his deadly rampage, it would be justifiable.

Funny that I know that, and you don't.

Heir to the Throne said...

httt: The standard for use of force in such a situation is no different for citizens or police.
gtl,
I am sure that the police union and their allies in Democratic party would disagree.
Rendell vetoes bill to expand 'castle doctrine'
Gov. Ed Rendell on Saturday vetoed three bills, including a measure to expand a person's right to use lethal force against a perceived threat outside of the home.

The current law, the so-called castle doctrine, already protects residents' right to defend themselves in their homes, or "castles." The bill would have extended that right beyond the home and removed a person's "duty to retreat" to avoid a potentially violent confrontation.

"The bill as passed encourages the use of deadly force, even when safe retreat is available, and advances a 'shoot first, ask questions later' mentality," Mr. Rendell said in a statement issued Saturday afternoon. "I do not believe that in a civilized society we should encourage violent and deadly confrontation when the victim can safely protect themselves."

Pgh_Knight said...

Whatever.... this was a terrible tragedy.

"I pray that our Heavenly Father may assuage the anguish of your bereavement, and leave you only the cherished memory of the loved and lost..."

To make this political and try to say "political rhetoric" made him do this is disgusting. Call BS all you want... because this is it.

gtl said...

httt,

The standard in situations like the horror on Saturday is, and was, "Is the perp a clear threat to the public if he escapes? If yes, then any use of force to neutralize him is justified. Clearly, Mr. Loughner fit that profile, and was tackled, disarmed, and held for police. I will say no more on this subject, since it diverges from the main topic.

rich10e said...

you should pull this entire thread "STFU with the eliminationist rhetoric" because all the BS was from your side of the aisle...krugman,olbermann,maddow...
all the kings men...now that its known that the kid was a stalker, a hater, not some right wing kook, but pulling it that would take integrity and courage!!!

Pgh_Knight said...

House Republicans Vote for the Rape of Little Girls
Posted by Maria

Republicans Wage War On Christmas!
Posted by Maria

Palin Fans Flames in PA
Posted by Maria

There's Going to be a Showdown
Posted by Maria

Maria Lupinacci said...

rich10e: So, because you think I'm wrong I should pull down this post, does that mean that Palin was admitting she was wrong when she pulled down her crosshairs?

Pgh_Knight:
"House Republicans Vote for the Rape of Little Girls" -- that was a statement of fact because they did.

"Republicans Wage War On Christmas!" - Seriously? The "War on Christmas" is a Republican meme. I'm quoting their own phrase back to them.

"Fanning Flames" and "Showdown" - Yes! This is exactly like calling for "second amendemt remedies" or saying I want citizens to be "armed and dangerous."

And, of course, I am a elected official/candidate for office doing this.

Not.

EdHeath said...

If Republicans/conservatives were not pushing Libertarian/Ayn Rand type philosophies, then maybe their hands would be spotless in this thing. If they didn't say that government is the problem, then their hands would be squeeky clean. And the reaction of the left *after* the shooting has nothing to do with the shooting itself. But, whatever, Republicans/conservatives just think their actions have no consequences.

Bob Herbert had a good column in the NYTimes today (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/11/opinion/11herbert.html?_r=1&hp). 150,000 (not counting 9/11) have died by guns in the US, in the last decade. If we are truly appalled at what happened in Tucson, then we could use this moment to start to do something about a forgotten 150,000 Americans. But I doubt conservative politicians or commenters here will do anything. After all, many of the 150,000 were poor and/or minorities.

rich10e said...

Maria,
i think you're a well intentioned and decent person. I think you throw bs out like you did to just generate dialogue.I think also at time you and dayvoe are over the top in promoting hysteria. As Howard Kurtz said, "Let’s be honest: Journalists often use military terminology in describing campaigns. We talk about the air war, the bombshells, targeting politicians, knocking them off, candidates returning fire or being out of ammunition. So we shouldn’t act shocked when politicians do the same thing. Obviously, Palin should have used dots or asterisks on her map. But does anyone seriously believe she was trying to incite violence?" NO!! you know that and so do I.

gtl said...

Terminology like "bombshells," or "attack ads," or whatever, are not the problem.

Painting those who disagree as traitors; manufacturing outrage and a feeling that "others" are threatening to take away their way of life (Sharia Law! Illegal immigrant babies!); pairing "Take back the government" with "The Tree of Liberty...watered with the blood of tyrants;" and following that up with "revolutions are necessary...." That's the problem. If that hasn't led to some nut deciding that he'll be a hero if he shoots down some traitorous "socialist" yet, ....it will.